Hi Steve & crew,
First, thanks so much for sharing all of this super valuable info with the world, what a difference it can make on not only enjoyment of riding, but longevity, reduction or elimination of injuries, and more.
I also appreciate how generous you are with your time, (sure, we pay a small amount for more personal access), but I surely don’t expect an “online bike fit” !!, and appreciate any info you can share.
I will do my due diligence and study & learn from this site.
I obtained a Focus Cayo Evo, (med 52-53cm for my 31 ” inseam, 5’9″ tall, 50 yr. old, strong, good flexibility), a while back, which has a fairly “relaxed” seat tube angle I believe.
I purchased a Lite 209 and have only a few short rides on, playing with the seat tilt a bit, going on feel, until a git a digital level, as well as some fore & aft.
I wanted to comment on how much of a noticeable difference moving my cleats back, (about 7mm) has made. First, in feels as though I’m able to keep my 360 stroke more fluid with less “dead-spots”. 2nd, it feels that I far less pressure on the bottom of my feet, as the cleat is off a more curved part of the shoe, and in an area that distributes the load over a larger area.
And lastly, I feel I have more power, although I think the SMP is helping, (coming from a Fizik Aliante). It even feels that the ride is a tad better, (maybe the SMP distributes the forces to ones bottom better, and maybe hollow seat rails?).
I’m still working on “sit-bone” , (I forgot the ramus name you explained in one of your pieces, which is a bit better than the Fizik, and lessen with forward lean, and better shorts, not riding back to back days, etc. I’d suspect my goal is to get to a point where my weight is distributed over as large an area as possible on the saddle.
I’ve attached a photo of the bike, (will get a friend to take one of me on it too). I’m sure you’ll see some strange items, like the angle of the 3T Ergonova bars, and the way I have the stem steer set up for the time.
I just wanted to let you know how much one small change made so far. If you have time for suggestions, great, but I’ll be able to glean many of my questions here with a little searching too.
Thanks, Scott
G’day Scott,
I’m glad that you’re embarking on the journey! The comments you’ve made are fairly ‘normal’ in the sense of what happens when people stop believing the standard info that’s been around for too long and start trialling what works best for them. I’m happy to have been able to point you in the right direction.
Re the SMP seat; the aim is to spread the load over the greatest area of the underside of the pelvis with no obvious hots pots or pressure points. When in the drops you should feel as though the rear of your buttocks are firmly against the rise towards the rear of the seat.
Re your handlebars; yes, you do have them rotated up too far. That means that when in the drops your hand has to be semi vertical to grip the bars. Doing that makes sprinting off the seat awkward. It also causes you to bend your elbows more than with a more natural hand position when riding on the seat. This lowers the torso more than would be the case with a more natural bar position set at the same height relative to the seat. What I suggest is that you rotate your bars down so that the grip area of the drops feels more natural and normal to grip. Typically with tape off, the rear of the underside of the drops will run uphill towards the front by 5 – 7 degrees but it can vary a few degrees outside of that. Once you’re happy with your drop bar rotation angle, then move the brake hoods so that you can reach them with an unbent or near unbent wrist.
Best of luck and if you run into any issues, just ask.
Regards,
Steve
Greetings Steve,
Thanks for the helpful info. I’ve made some tweaks a couple times with the bars, and in the drops especially, it feels much better. I feel a bit stretched out reaching the bars, so I may slide the seat forward a tad, (or possibly go with a 100 mm stem, from the 110 that’s on there.
I’m becoming more comfortable with the seat each time I ride. I;m wondering if a seat like this 209 Lite can be a bit wide in the middle, (I have fairly large upper legs at 21″ around)? It’s a tad wider than the Aliante that came of, & the rails extends slightly beyond the nose.
Anyway, I’ll keep adjusting & enjoying the small improvements each time.
Thanks again,
Scott
G’day Scott,
When using an SMP is really important that the angle and set back of the seat allow the rider to naturally feel as though their butt is pressed against the rise towards the rear of the seat. Do you feel like this?
If not, then the likely reason that the seat feels a bit wide is that you may not be sitting far enough back on it.
Of course, that may be completely wrong, so let me know.
Thanks again for the reply Steve,
I have been aware of the rear of my butt against the up-turned portion of the seat, most of the time, (I do move around, as many others). I’ve also placed my rear a bit beyond that, to see where the “threshold spot” might be, (but this does feel like riding “on top” of the saddle.
Funny thing, I keep my bike in the living room for now, so to continue to refer to and analyze what needs to be done, and I thought the seat looked even further back than the relaxed seat tube makes it.
Sure enough, it had slide back close to 10mm, (good thing I marked it), as you mentioned can happen, with the added ability to push on the back of the saddle.
So, are your implying that the saddle could feel a bit narrower if your back where one should be on an SMP? It seems a bit counter-intuitive, but I’m all ears.
Cheers, Scott
G’day Scott,
It’s only counter intuitive because some SMP users who don’t hold their backsides firmly against the rise towards the rear of the seat sit with a more upright pelvic angle. Changing pelvic angle (more upright vs less upright) can cause changes in hip rotation which in turn may mean that the inner thighs move outward or inward giving more or less clearance between thighs and seat.
This is not a universal ‘rule’ but is not uncommon.
Hello again Steve,
Thanks again, your explanations make sense & has helped. I’ve dipped the nose & moved saddle forward a couple mm’s, which helps me keep (& feel) that upward rear of the saddle, (which gives me lots of power too!, & a possible reason for rail movement on the seat clamps, as you mentioned).
I’m also grateful for the SMP rail design, in regards to fore & aft movement.
I’m now beginning to “settle in” to the saddle, little by little, (plus, I bought it used from a gal who only put a few hundred miles on it), so maybe more break-in? I know am feeling small pressure areas in several spots, instead of one or 2 “hot-spots”. Of course, the pair of shorts / bibs I wear matters too.
With your help, I’m really sensing what hip-rotation feels like, and how it effects comfort & power, but also, how it effects other areas of the body & riding position.
Also, your suggestion on tilting my bars to have the drops “flatter”, really feels more natural, and with less reach, more control as you mentioned.
Lastly, I’ve been watching lots of pro cycling on my cmptr lately, (NBC Gold package rocks, if you don’t watch tv like me), and I’m amazed at how many pros have really different positions & set-ups! Some look as though their spindle is under their toes, others are almost as upright, (in cruise-mode), as I am on their bikes, and others are way less stretched out. I guess it’s what works for them, (for that day, that race etc.), in the meantime, I’ll stick with your advise!
cheers, Scott
G’day Scott,
I’m glad that you’re making progress. Anything that enhances the simple pleasure of riding a bike is a plus!
Re your comments on the pro scene. In my experience as a group, they display the same spectrum of dysfunction as the resot of the cycling population with the significant differences being that –
1. On average they are younger
2. They’ve got bigger engines and better work ethic.
3. The big one; they’re self selecting. No matter how poor many of them look on a bike, if they couldn’t do what they do, they wouldn’t be there. My approximate rule of thumb is that 1/3 look really good / 1/3 look reasonable and 1/3 look terrible…………….but they perform, which is what they are paid to do.